post for 13 February 2002

rules question

Ok I have question about Honorable Sepuku and IDE Mischisuna(whatever his name is) First I do not have the cards in front of me but i believe i remember them.

Ok player A secrets Player B's Samurai who has 3 PH. Now if player A plays honorable sepeku on player B's Samurai then bowa Ide Michisuna to stop the samurai from becoming rehonored. What happens

1.) Player B's Samurai dies dishonored and he loses 3 honor because of it? 2.)Player b's Samurai dies dishonored but he loses no honor (more accuratley he gains three, and loses three) (I ask this because I believe that honorable sepeku says becomes honored commits sepekku and you gain their personal honor in family honor) 3) Neither because honorable sepeku says can only be played on your own personalities?

3)

rules questions

The path not taken. "Kiho react: bow a monk/shug when an opponent discards an action card without using its printed effect..."

When using the word "opponent" it refers as a targeting restriction only, or it also refers as an active discard by the opponent?

Targeting restriction only.

The question is if i use kage exp 5 to search his deck and discard an action card can i react with the path not taken, or not.

You can.

Rules Question

Can I play Defend your honour on an honour loss from a duel refusal? Let's say i have Hida Koun exp with a crystal katan and Hiruma Masagaro. Someone challenges Masagaro, I refusal the challenge (iajitsu) and would normally loose 7 honour. However, can I now play Defend your Honour:

Yes. The Honor loss is coming from the Iaijutsu Challenge card (since that's where it's printed), which was played by another player as a Limited action.

Challenge with Hida Koun, and assuming I win, give him the honour loss instead?

Yes.

Deeds, not Words Question

When a player brings a personality into play, can they choose not to ignore the honor gain even if they pay full cost?

The player must either reduce the Gold cost by 2 or gain Honor if the Personality is of their Faction.

REVERSAL: Since, for the sake of consistancy, the rulebook now lets you reduce the cost by 2 instead of pay 2 Gold less, it's legal to go with the "reduce by 2" option in all cases, even when the Personality already has a cost of 0. (It's legal to apply a penalty or reduction to a number that's already 0; only in cases where the reduction is a cost does it matter whether the final value is the full amount less than the starting value.) Among other things, this means Toturi's Army players are no longer forced to gain Honor for Toku.

Ie, let's say you have Kyuden Hida and a jade works. Someone plays deeds not words, and you have Hida Kuroda (6/7/3) as your only affordable peep.

Can you either: A - bring him out reduced @ 5 gold, even though you paid 7 B - pay 7 for him and just say you're not taking the honour (and consequently you dont loose 3 honour to deeds, not words?).

A is legal, B is not.

Rules Question

if i use Crossroads and say lower a jade works 0 can i not use the Stronghold produce 1 additional Gold when bowed to produce Gold for a Cavalry card. or is it the cost on the card and i can use it ?????

Shiro Ide cares about current cost. Crossroads only reduces the Jade Works' cost while it's in the Province. Right after you play the Jade Works, its cost changes back to 3 and it produces extra under Shiro Ide's trait.

Force total questions

1) When I have a personality with armored steeds and bow the steeds to take two consecutive actions, if I play strike at the tail bowing the personality that has the steeds, does the force of the already bowed steeds contribute?

No. Strike at the Tail counts the Force total of your unit right before you bowed to play it. [card text] Whenever you need a unit's Force total, you apply the rules concerning bowed cards not adding. [AOF rulebook p. 55] They are not applied only during resolution.

However, since SatT cares about the Force of INDIVIDUAL Follower cards it targets for destruction, those are NOT considered 0 when they're bowed. They always count for their full Force.

Unit Forces are affected by bowing. Card Forces are not.

2) Will To Do What We Must allow a weenie to take out any unit with a bowed personality?

Yes, since TDWWM compares unit Force to unit Force.

rules question (Jeff Alexander)

Page 61 of AOF rulebook(relevent text)

"Sometimes Personalities may destroy themselves by committing seppuku. If this happens, the Personality dies honorably, with no Honor loss, and becomes Honorable Dead regardless of whether or not he >or she was Dishonored."

Page 61 and 64 of An Oni's Fury rulebook seem to disagree with one another. The quote above from page 61 states that there is no honor loss. On 64 under the Special Traits/Samurai, it says that the honor loss is reduced to 1.

Which is correct?

Both. They're dealing with two different things.

Page 61 says that when a Personality dies through seppuku of any kind, he is restored to Honor and dies Honorably, therefore there is no loss of honor from dying Dishonorably.

Page 64 says that when a samurai chooses to commit seppuku in response to being involved in a loss of Honor to the samurai's controller, that triggering loss is reduced to 1.

rules question

next if you used Ide Michisuna with the new seppuku rules what would happen? Since the rules sy the always die honorable and become honorable dead. but he as a reaction stops the rehonoring?

Someone who is Dishonored, commits seppuku, and is prevented from being restored to Honor will still die, and since he is still Dishonored he will cause the Honor loss that Dishonored Personalities normally cause when they die.

rules question (Jeff Alexander)

This seems to come up every year-and-a-half or so, I think.

Remorseful Seppuku does not force the victim to undergo the rulebook definition of Seppuku (the latter isn't even an action).

Not the built-in response that Samurai can choose, no, but there is more than one way to die from a seppuku effect.

You can only commit rulebook seppuku in _response_ to being dishonored or participating in an action or choice that causes honor loss;

Actually, only the latter. Becoming dishonored does not allow rulebook Samurai seppuku.

Remorseful Seppuku is used under entirely different circumstances. In addition, it specifically says there is no honor gain or loss, a reference to the usual result of a dying dishonored personality (honor loss equal to printed honor).

It *used* to say that. The reason it doesn't anymore is that by explicitly stating there is no honor loss, it changes from "a reference to the usual result of a dying dishonored Personality" and becomes an additional effect of the card. I didn't like that.

Seppuku is "bigger" than L5R rules, like the word "sensei". It gets used for a lot of things. Honorable Seppuku, Remorseful Seppuku, and I Believed in You are not the same thing as rulebook Seppuku, as many of them have completely different triggers.

None of them equate exactly to the samurai-response-to-Honor- loss seppuku, no, but they all fall squarely under the "death by any version of seppuku restores the Personality to Honor first" rule.

rules question (Jeff Alexander)

That isn't really the question. The question is whether the reference to Seppuku on the cards refers to the card itself (which is how I think it is), or if it refers to the Seppuku ability that Samurai have as outlined in the rulebook (as some other people think).

*That* is the question I would like Jeff to answer.

Which card in particular does the question concern? I think a general answer is far too unlikely to be 100% correct.