Overlaying: Waystation of the Path + Recruitment Officer

L5R CCG Rules board, 17 February 2012 to 19 February 2012

A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.

A player, 17 February 2012

Consider I overlay a Monk via Waystation of the Path

Reaction: After another player's action targets your performing Henshin, target another of your Personalities: The Henshin is reborn. Transfer his attachments and tokens to the other Personality. The action's effects that would destroy your Henshin instead overlay him onto the Personality.

onto a Ronin generated by Recruitment Officer

Reaction: After engaging at a battlefield where you control one or more units, bow this card: Create a 2F/2C/2PH Ronin • Samurai Personality there. Remove him from the game when this turns ends.

Is removing the Ronin either a "ongoing effect" (I'd say "no", as it looks like a "delayed instantaneous effect") a "reference" (I'd also say "no" as I think this means explicit references in abilities like "he bowes to:") to the Card that is inhereted by him through:

One card may overlay another, reflecting a process of transformation. When an effect says, for example, "Overlay the Shugenja onto your Personality," the Shugenja is the overlaying card and the Personality is the overlaid card. In overlaying, the overlaying card is placed on the overlaid card, and then the overlaid card is removed from the game. Any effects on the overlaying card end, its attachments and tokens are discarded, and for reference purposes it is considered to be the overlaid card. The overlaying card inherits the game state of the overlaid card, including bowed and dishonorable status, attachments, tokens, ongoing effects, and references to the card.

All in one simple question: Is my Henshin removed at the end of the turn, if he overlayed a Recruitment Officer Token?

Jon Palmer (rules official), 19 February 2012

Consider I overlay a Monk via Waystation of the Path

onto a Ronin generated by Recruitment Officer

Is removing the Ronin either a "ongoing effect" (I'd say "no", as it looks like a "delayed instantaneous effect") a "reference" (I'd also say "no" as I think this means explicit references in abilities like "he bowes to:") to the Card that is inhereted by him through:

All in one simple question: Is my Henshin removed at the end of the turn, if he overlayed a Recruitment Officer Token?

In this case you're right that it's a delayed instantaneous effect, however, that is part of the game state of the overlaid card, which will be inherited by the new card. So your Henshin will be removed from game at the end of the turn.