The continuing saga of Invest costs

L5R CCG Rules board, 25 March 2014

A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.

A player, 25 March 2014

Seriously hate being That Guy, but I hate unintended consequences more. From Page 22:

Invest: This is a trait that starts with “Invest” and a Gold cost (for example, “Invest (2):”). When paying for a card entering play, you may increase its Gold cost by the additional cost in its Invest trait, once, to get an additional effect after it enters play (for example, “Gain 1 Honor” or “Give this card a +2F token.”) Things that can pay for the card type entering play can also pay for the Invest cost.

vs. this clarification:

Ben Higgins wrote:

Invest does not change the Gold Cost of a card. When paying for a card entering play, you may pay additional Gold for the card equal to the additional cost in its Invest trait, once, to get an additional effect after it enters play (for example, “Gain 1 Honor” or “Give this card a +2F token.”) This does not increase the Gold Cost stat of the card, but is treated as other effects that increase required payments by using "paying" language.

The Reference Rules probably need updating. This "increasing required payments" does not seem to be intuitive, but it appears the intent is "to activate the Invest trait on a card, you may increase the Gold cost for the card to enter play by the additional cost" (which does not increase the Gold cost of the card). This allows for interactions with language on Colonial Dojo, for example, without making the Invest a separate cost to be paid.

The problematic and rules-lawyery phrase is "increase its Gold cost". Reword that and I believe "intent" has been achieved.

Ben Higgins (rules official), 25 March 2014

Seriously hate being That Guy, but I hate unintended consequences more. From Page 22:

vs. this clarification:

The Reference Rules probably need updating. This "increasing required payments" does not seem to be intuitive, but it appears the intent is "to activate the Invest trait on a card, you may increase the Gold cost for the card to enter play by the additional cost" (which does not increase the Gold cost of the card). This allows for interactions with language on Colonial Dojo, for example, without making the Invest a separate cost to be paid.

The problematic and rules-lawyery phrase is "increase its Gold cost". Reword that and I believe "intent" has been achieved.

The reference rules are indeed a living document (in that like the CR, can be updated to reflect new mechanics and clarifications), and we will update them to reflect this clarification to Invest; Invest is not meant to increat a card's Gold Cost stat, but rather the variable amount a player must pay to Recruit, Equip or play the card.

Thank you for the concern, and don't be afraid to point out these inconsistencies; the Rules Team is only human, and occasionally use a lower case word (cost in this case) when another way of saying what we mean (as was stated in my ruling) would be better suited.