Hey guys so Kenku duelist- Does it also add the duelist trait to the personality?
Oracle of the Void #rules
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Nope, why would it?
The Oracle indicates he has the duelist trait
Why would he, if it didn't add it
By the rule that titles convey keywords to their own card.
Oh awesome! That's what I was thinking. I'm rocking him on radakast in my nagas deck
It's a combo big time
But he doesn't give it to his Personality.
Oh boo
Lol
It's his own keyword, so it does nothing.
What's the point of him having the trait then lol
The card has the title "Kenku Duelist", so by the rules at the time, it's a "Duelist" card.
There wasn't any, even then.
At least, not mechanically
Bayushi Yokuan in Scorpion Clan Coup was a Duelist before there were even Rules for it.
No, I know that. But it seems doubly meaningless on a follower
Yes
It is what it is. I mean, there are interactions with the keyword, just not many that would apply. Dojo of the Dauntless from Evil Portents could straighten that Follower, for instance. π
Naga Apprentice has the "Apprentice" (or should do), but it didn't do anything when it was printed, and doesn't now, either
(One for your list, Brook π)
Do any cards interact with "Apprentice"? Because, even if other cards have it as a keyword, I wouldn't add it if it does literally nothing.
Yes, but Kenji duelist trait was specifically added on oracle so one would assume it has meaning
You could also give the Kenku +2-3F with "A Rival Eliminated".
If someone targets your Kenku, you could React with "Half-Breath Strike". So, because there technically exist some interactions, I added the Duelist he would technically have by the Rules of the time.
Gotcha, no worries just wanted to clarify. Btw: rules update with followers that add force/chi should also add their traits. Be wayyyy cooler
cavalry followers would be broken then
Beo just means the handful of Followers that have "+" stats rather than their own, like Kenku Duelist or Inkyo. But still, yeah... no. π
slippery slope π
Ah good point didn't think about that, but yes I meant only followers that gave +stats
Thanks for clarifying though guys
If that worked, some tool would figure out how to give that Elephant Personality the Ninja trait.
The Shinobi style one, for all the rooftop skulking.
Though, I suppose, making a Nameless Elephant would be entertaining.
Speaking of, I regret that back in the day I never got to (Nameless) Shadow-taint the Ki-Rin Personality.
That would've made for a fun story.
Haha, elephant ninja stomp!
Nameless Elephant phasing through the walls...
Elephant ninja theif!
[attachment: unknown.gif]
Haha
Question: card rising terror- Can the fear effect be used in non battle??
Answers on: Rising Terror
No.
Erm... well, let me check. π
Under the most current Rules, no, because "Fear X" is shorthand for "Bow a target enemy Follower or Personality without Follower with Force less than or equal to X", and cards aren't "enemy" cards unless you're against each other during battle.
I can see if that jives with Diamond, but I believe it does.
Ok, so he can is it outside battle then?
We're playing most recent rules though
No, you can't use it outside of battle, because there are no "enemy" cards to target when a Battle isn't happening.
Ah ok I see that in your initial response
Thanks!
Also: do the dark virtues/ in general virtues have a prerequisite to play?
Nothing it doesn't say on the card.
Ok, so don't need a paragon out anything specific?
Nope.
Ok thanks!
Answers on: Rosoku Sensei, Enlightened Ruler
For rosoku sensei: Would it count as a ring for enlightened ruler
Since it's an event?
Nope. It only counts for actions.
And what about for the enlightened trait?
Not for the +F bonus, but if for some reason Rosoku is bowed and you want to straighten him, it will work for the action.
Ok thank you!
That's what we thought
Hrm. Actually, as currently worded in the Oracle, it wouldn't, but I should fix that.
That is, it wouldn't work for that Rulebook action, but when would that happen anyway, righgt?
Appreciate your help! We're definitely trying some new cards
Ah, actually forget I said I should fix it. I forgot about the errata. It's fine as-is.
And does NOT work with the Rulebook straightening action.
Ok thanks!
It only works for actions, and they have to be on non-Stronghold cards. Yep.
So I think I asked before so apologies Haha Can I use naga shujenjas ability as a battle action at a battle he is not present? It's an open action so I wasn't sure
Usually "Open" meant "Battle/Open", but if I recall correctly, during those eras, you couldn't, as his action didn't say you could, and didn't target any explicit cards in the battle, etc.
I feel like I have had this answered since back in jade days and I slowly forget again... then upon forgetting, feel like it should work again Haha
Thanks!
I remember playing against Naga in both Clan Wars and Jade.
Fun times. I felt bad for the Naga player most of the time.
But when their deck worked, it worked.
Getting the tokens and the Naga Shuggies going was hard to deal with after a certain point. And then almost impossible.
Then Jade came with Blackened Sky. And then in late Jade they got Purusha.
I think I might've given the wrong contemporary answer to this when you asked before, but under the most current rules, which thank goodness you're using, yeah he definitely can't. Though, since he just gives a blanket F bonus to everybody, there's not much reason not to just use him in your Action Phase before declaring an attack.
@saaam , Haha totally! I have really mixed it up now. I'm running gold heavy with all three constrictors (would obviously be better with new border cards). And gold heavy with house of contracts for kolat master, test of honor, etc. Got a win list night in our 3 player game thanks to yabjin wyrm calvary scooting around on giant chalderas buffed by naga shugenja.
@Brook Cunningham , got it. I know I can do it as an open but prior to attacking but the added versatility of being able to do it in battle with him at home would be nice admittedly. One of my opponents was playing raid mantis and I don't always want to assign because of range attack threats and can't utilize prior to his raid
Ah, yeah, Raid is one of those edge cases where it would be nice, indeed.
Do you have Mountains of Exile, the Yobanjin Cavalry factory, too?
Oh, no I haven't heard of that one. I have been toiling around with builds for it and trying different things. So the wyrms in there so I can take a province with only 1 guy and my forests still produce since its a non human. I also put in the kenku duelists because they boost the constrictor abilities and protect from duels/ are nonhuman. I'll check mountains now though
We consistently play at least 3 player so taking a province with 1 guy is pretty key to not losing the next turn. I also put in ghedai and was able to take my buddies monk province with a plains of uchi and a prophet's tower... very sneaky moved him over
Also, one more general question. My buddy had some newer kihos that no longer specifically say "bow". So do they really not bow or is it just implied?
I assume they don't bow but just curious, cause they're super solid
Bowing is not implied, no.
Ok, that's what I thought. Wowza, those are cool kihos though!
What's up guys? Completely new to the game after finding a bunch of samurai edition cards super cheap. Was just wondering if particular actions can only be completed by particular people or at particular times. An example I see on a card is Dark Virtue Limited. I think limited is before the battle phase, but what about the Dark Virtue part of the card? Are there only particular people that can perform that kind of action? Also, I saw an action that said Terrain Battle. Does there have to be a terrain or region card on the field before you can perform that action? Thanks for any help you can give, and thanks for letting me join this discord.
Welcome!
1. No special Rules about who can perform Dark Virtue actions. 2. Terrains are just a special kind of Strategy card that enters play on the battlefield. There's a dropbox folder with Rules pinned in the General section, which can help. The last Comprehenseive Rules are in the Twenty Festivals folder, and those should be enough to use Samurai era cards, give or take.
Erm. Actually, I'm not sure where that dropbox link is pinned. I'll just link it here:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/vsabdrqgcqfqepp/AACNYaigHIRNTZvZVRq9K0joa?dl=0
[L5RRules]
It was in the L5R section, actually. Found it!
Thank you so much for the help. I'm slowly getting the rules I think, but the rulebooks I've seen are a little lengthy. Just wanting to make sure I have an idea what's going on before I get into a game.
Oh, well, the Comprehensive Rules are exceptionally lengthy compared to a Rulebook, but there's a PDF of the Samurai Edition one in that dropbox too.
Which is the most current edition of the rules?
The Comprehensive ones and Twenty Festivals.
Sweet. I see the twenty festivals tab and will check it out. I really appreciate the help.
Building a Lion Clan deck since that's the only stronghold I have.
If you're playing with older cards though, the "Legacy Rules" in "Alternate Formats" help a lot, though they are missing a couple of things.
Found 800 cards and only 2 strongholds in them. Both Lion Clan.
Ha. Well, that's what the Oracle is for, I guess? π Proxies and all
I'll definitely check those rules out too.
That's true. I'll proxy some eventually, and probably buy more too. The game looks to be super fun, and I have a friend close by here in Minnesota who has a ton of cards.
Your friend's cards are from the same era give or take? The L5R LCG made by Fantasy Flight from 2017-2021 isn't compatible with the CCG made by Alderac from 1995-2015, just to let you know. But everything from the original 20 year run is mostly compatible with itself.
Yeah he has all CCG cards. I think his cards are from before samurai edition.
Cool. Just thought I'd check.
Yeah thanks for checking. The LCG looks pretty cool too, but I think the CCG seems more interesting.
Is there anything in the CCG that is really broken? Any particular cards that are crazy strong?
Well, every era had its strong and weak stuff, which cycled in and out with legality arcs. 20 years is a lot of history to cover, but I'd say a couple of the worst offenders were the Shrine of Spirits Stronghold for the short-lived Spirit faction/clan in Spirit Wars expansion, and Moto Chagatai Experienced 4; the former was not legal for long at all and was banned from "Open/Legacy" tournaments, and the latter was banned DURING his intended legality.
Damn that sounds like quick bannings lol.
That's pretty cool. I was just curious. I'll have to look those cards up now.
For the most part, L5R didn't ban much; if things needed fixing, it was usually via errata and/or MRP.
Makes sense
One last question. When you bow a personality for a ranged attack, it's only targeting something at the same battlefield right? Unless the card specifically says so?
Yeah, very generally. "Ranged X Attack" is shorthand for "Target a Follower or a Personality without Followers in the current enemy army. If its Force is equal to or less than X, destroy it.β
Some cards actually do Ranged Attacks without bowing, I would note.
Oh that's true. I've seen that too.
EDIT: Wait, wrong
Sorry.
Lol I have both of those cards. You almost got me there.
Answers on: Righteous Doshin
Looks like Righteous Doshin have a Ranged 2 attack without bowing
Yeah, I was trying to find common SE cards and find an example, but I misread.
In general I assume most actions can only be taken only once per turn unless they say otherwise?
Yes, Once Per Turn is the default on actions (from Lotus Edition onward).
Sweet. Thanks again for all the help. I'm slowly digging through these rules while I'm building a fate deck. You've been a ton of help.
It was my job for a while. π
Once I start to get the hang of this I'll probably download sun and moon to try to get some reps on there too.
I think the box of cards I found was where someone just opened a bunch of packs and put them in a box. Nearly 80 rares I think out of the almost 800 cards.
And they donated them all to a goodwill. The cards are in perfect shape.
At least it wasn't all Commons. π
Pretty fortunate for sure
Answers on: Burn it Down
If I have a card that does 7 ranged attack, and I use the card Burn It Down, does it just kill the enemy province if it has 7 strength?
In order to destroy a province, you have to win the battle and then if the attacking armyβs Force was greater than the defending armyβs Force plus the Province Strength of the battleτeldβs Province, the Attacker also destroys the Province. So, to answer your question, probably? Depends how well they defend.
That makes sense
That's all assessed at the battle's resolution, after all the actions are done.
I didn't know if you could like sneaky backdoor kill a province with Burn it down lol
Answers on: Burn it Down
Like before the battle was resolved or anything
Not like that. There are precious few ways to destroy Provinces outside of Battle Resolution.
Yeah that makes sense. Seemed a little too easy.
Sure, NP. 0 Strength ones don't just go poof like 0 Chi Personalities, but I don't blame you for wondering, considering the latter.
@Brook Cunningham , very helpful for me and ive been playing since the old rules and always giving me the low down!
Thanks to these folks!
Can someone tell me how I can search for 2 keywords at once on Oracle? Specifically, what do I need to type to add a second keyword?
Yeah, I'd love to figure that one out too.
Seems like logical OR or AND or || or && don't work, either either the overall field or specific ones.
Yeah I tried ; And * And various others
Nothing seemed to work for me
Click the help page
Awesome will do!
AND/OR should work in the all field
I go for the boolean shorthand though: + / -
for single words, AND is the default
you need to really do it in the all field... the keywords field assumes it's all one phrase, so multi-word keywords will work. "dark virtue", etc...
so: +keyword:red +keyword:"dark blue"
in all
(where the pluses really aren't needed.. it's the default position)
Ok thank you sir! Very helpful!
So wondering when a personality straightens do his followers straighten as well? Specifically, with mantis samurai
No.
That's what I assumed, thanks!
No problem! π
Haha, really put in some work making that fit into my toturis deck but it's just way worse than wavemen!
Which men? :/
Might be waveman
It's a 4 gold , 2 force follower straightens the unit after combat. It's just waaaaay better and no 3 honor requirement. I thought mantis samurai would be tricky because it's each straighten phase And we're playing multiplayer
Hrm. Interesting. The Honor and Treachery one isn't displaying as the MRP, but it is.
Don't forget Stand Against the Waves. Ahh, it was fun when that first came out.
Oh its in there! It's veryyyyyy fast and really hard to target its units. Super fun deck so far
Utilizes 3 ph abilities too
Which ones, beside SoP?
Glorious mission and souls sacrifice are in there. I think both are super solid
Hunh, that is a solid one. (Glorious Mission.)
What format are you making the deck in?
So it's like kind of open/ legacy but we ate currently only playing old border (not because we don't like new stuff but it was too overwhelming to look since we hadn't played since spirit wars)
And then we have modified and we don't play cards that go in every deck, like inheritance. Kolat duplicate, etc
Glorious mission is really cool in there because of the big follwers so I can take a province with one personality. Souls sacrifice works really well in combo with followers that bow opponents and stand against waves
Gotcha. Neat.
Question: Can I have my samurai personality that's dishonored commit seppuku in response to force of will
Nope.
The loss of Family Honour happens after they're dead. You can't seppuku in response to already being dead.
Also, note that the change is until the end of the turn, so if they have high Chi, you'll lose FH equal to that, not to their printed PH.
Ah, yes of course We assumed that was the case. Thanks for the clarification
@saaam Shiwan's initial answer is correct, but the additional info provided is not. When a dishonorable Personality dies, you always lose Honor equal to their PRINTED PH, not the PH with modifiers.
But Force of Will explicitly says the change is until end of turn.
Well, consider, when a dishonorable Personality dies another, regular way, their PH is already adjusted to 0, but the loss isn't 0. How do you determine what the value of the loss IS? It's because it's ONLY by printed. If that makes sense?
Yeah, fair enough.
Thank you! That would have almost made a difference in the game Haha! (Not sarcastic it was 1 modifier and if it was 2 I would have won!)
btw in emperor seppuku became open action. and there's no player rulebook seppuku ability in ivory.
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Ok, interesting! Thanks kempy
That's... kinda dumb.
I guess also hilarious, if you steal their Personality and dishonour it, then make it seppuku.
It would have won me the game. Should have had reju commit seppuku as an open Haha
Well, back when Reju was around, you couldn't do it that way.
Well we've adapted lots of modern rules on most things. Exp 3 doji reju was tearing it up!
I miss Reju Exp2 + Armor of Shadows Exp + For the Empire. Although it took two Uniques, that tore up early Gold.
I'll have to look up armor of shadows!
The Exp. one gave you Shadowlands, so you now had a 5C Double Chi who wins ties, who can For the Empire any Samurai, and gain a +1/+1 after.
Oh noyce! Sweet little combo!
Back then, yeah, it was pretty big. Because you could run several useful Shugenja in Crane, and have access to Secrets, Touch of Death, Force of Will, Shame, and basically make a control deck off of Crane, with their insane gold curve.