Rules for 5 January 2005

The Rules for Wednesday, January 5, 2005

Multiple Focus / Shamate Pass

* Kakita : He must focus once if possible, with 1 to 3 cards. Let's say he chooses to focus (no Smoke, no Shadow's Claw) with 3 cards.

Are the 3 focus simultaneous?

It is a single Focus, with 3 cards making it up.

If yes, how do you react with Smoke on this? Discard at random?

Good question. I'll ask Jeff.

* Shamate Pass and Broken Sword of the Lion. I play a Broken sword of the Lion. All the peeps I own (ie the ones in my Dynasty too) are dishonored. I reveal one on Shamate Pass, its honor is still 0 (Printed PH, reduce to 0 because dishonnored + 2 then applay dishonnor again). When he is rehonored, what's its PH?

Shamate doesn't say a thing about printed PH, BUT it says pemanently add 2.

It is a permanent +2 PH bonus. It stays there even after Dishonor is ended. Dishonor imposes a 0 PH - Maximum - on the card. When that 0 PH cap is removed by becoming rehonored, the current PH of the personality will be Printed +/- modifiers, just like any other stat on any other card. In this case, that would be Printed + 2.

Rules for 29 and 30 December 2004 [RULES]

Comments Below:

"A card that can be attached to another player's Personalities is not "targeting with a card effect." Attaching a follower to a Personality is a rulebook effect; such cards just extend the number of legal targets. [JA, 5 October 2000]" (Accumulated Rulings, "Attaching")

Where exactly are the rules for the STANDARD ATTACHMENT ACTION you are talking about?

[MARTY] The standard Limited Phase Actions in the Diamond Edition Rulebook, pages 76 and 77.

Players have those 3 actions available to them. One of which is attaching Spells, Items, Ancestors, or Followers from hand. As stated in the Rulebook, the Action targets the Personality. However, the Action is printed in the Rulebook, not on the Item, Ancestor, Follower, or Spell card, and hence it is not an Action of said Card.

Can you give it a break down and show us how a spell or follower or item does not target the personality it is attaching itself to?

[MARTY] There is a mistake in perception. The Spell, Follower, Item, or Ancestor is not "attaching itself." There is no ability belonging to such a card that attaches it - only the ability in the Rulebook.

How do items, that dishonor the personality they attach to, not target the personality?

[MARTY] Well, for starters, there is no - choice - associated with the - effect - when it only works on the personality the card is attached / being attached to.

The choices between cards that would qualify for targeting were made when taking the Attachment Action. The triggered effects responding to what goes on are not targetedv if they can only affect the pre-determined Personality. A card which says "when this card enters play, bow it / its personality / all cards in this unit," or something to the same effect, it does not target that card. It is said, "when this card enters play, bow a card in its unit," that - would - be a case of the card implicit targeting under the old Diamond templating.

Note that for cards printed in Dawn of the Empire or later sets, targeting must be explicit only - the implicit "targeting due to choice" rules do not apply to these newer cards.

So, no, the Item, Spell, Ancestor, or Follower does not - target - the Personality you attach it to under a "normal" play. The Rulebook's Attachment Action does so, not the attached card. If the card had an - Action - that you used to attach it rather than by using the Rulebook's Attachment Action, it would target.

- Marty Lund Deputy Rules Monkey

Some clarifications / answers from Jeff [RULES]

Hey folks,

So, I got a few explanations from Jeff the other day about a few issues I had to ask you to wait on, so I'm passing them on now.

#1 - Card values when killed in mid-Action.

Check the card's current value at the time you have to make the comparison. Depending on the card text, this could happen as a targeting restriction or as a comparison on effect resolution.

Cards retain their assigned values in relationship to the game, even when put into the Discard Pile or removed from the game: printed values +/- any effects that have not expired.

So if you actually have to check the Force or Chi or Personal Honor of a Personality who gets destroyed in the middle of an Action, use the value they have in the Discard or Removed from the Game pile.

#2 - "After the end of the turn" vs. "Before the beginning of the next turn" timing.

These effects count as happening in the turns they reference, just like effects that say, "After Phase X" and "Before Phase Y." There is no "timing limbo" in between the two turns.

In reference to the direct question about "In Time of War," effects that happen "before the beginning" of the turn (say with Suitengu's Surge) will completely skirt around the Honor-cap, since it is after the last turn ended, but before In Time of War has established a new cap for the turn.

- Marty Lund Deputy Rules Monkey

Fwd from Jeff - Temples of Gisei Toshi question

Dang,

That's some quick turn-around there.

Anyway, the Temples of Gisei Toshi let you pick any one card that qualifies, once per use.

- Marty Lund Deputy Rules Monkey

Rules Question - Temples of Gisei Toshi question

Hey Jeff,

This one is kind of interesting. I'm not quite sure how the singular indicators work with "any" in this case. Can you get 2-4 Spells / Followers / Items or just 1?

You may get one card.

That should cover everything for Wednesday, January 5, 2005. If I missed your question, please repost if with the flag [RULES] as part of your Clear and Distinct subject line. I'll get back to you at the first opportunity.