Rules for

Hi everyone! First, a follow up to a question from yesterday. Tom O'Brien asked if Bayushi Kaukatsu's Reaction was Political. I said that, as I didn't have a copy of the card, I didn't really know, but the answer would be on the card. Well, I picked up some more Gold boosters today (out of another god box!), and lo and behold, one of my rares was Bayushi Kaukatsu! I can now definitively say that Kaukatsu's Reaction is *not* Political. So, there ya go.

If a personality with 3 personal honor has been dishonored, can they attach the Golden Obi of the Sun Goddess?

Nope. The Golden Obi looks at current personal honor, not printed or anything like that. A normally pure personality who happens to be in dire straits at the moment cannot grab the Golden Obi.

Just something I wanted to resolve.

Firstly does the rule of presence come into effect when moving someone elses personality into the battle. Ie to take an inacurate example to superior tactics in someone elses personality into an empty battle.

You can move someone elses personality into the battle currently being resolved as long as you already have someone there. Moving someone else's unit into a battle where you have no units will *not* satisfy Presence.

Secondly can a personality take an action at a battle he is not present at and which he is not moving himself into. (id be inclined to cross reference this with ranged attacks or some such just to be mean)

As long as the action satsifies Presence and Relevance, sure. A personality not at the battle who's trying to do a Ranged Attack has problems seperate from Presence and Relevance - Ranged Attacks specifically have to target opposing cards, and thus the card creating the RA *has* to actually be in the battle.

In case your wondering I _am_ trying to lead the questions, as the last time I checked Tomo could stay outside of all the battles and move a unit into the way of a sorrows path, not something Im too happy with.

Hmm...I'm very sorry about that. Tomo will be decapitated forthwith.

*snick*

There. However, that still leaves Isawa Riake, and she's much too cute to decapitate.

The use of Tomo/Riake's action that you describe above is perfectly legal. As long as Tomo/Riake's controller has satisfied Presence and Relevance in the current battle, it's perfectly fine for Tomo to use his action from a safe position at home.

Under Gold Edition rules, Ancestors are their own card type rather than a special type of Follower. This should mean that rules for Followers should not apply to Ancestors unless specifically stated. In particular:

Rules for using the Force and Chi of Ancestors seem to be missing from the GE rulebook.

Follow general rules for attached Fate cards. An attached card with a +X or -X will modify the attached personalities stats directly, while an attached card that just has a X value adds to the unit total, but not to the personality.

Do special restriction for attaching Followers (e.g. Otako Kamako) still apply to Ancestors?

Nope. Ancestors are now a completely and totally different card type than Followers, and absolutely *none* of the Follower relevant cards apply to them.

Since Darks Lord´s Favor can "Reaction: Reduce one Honor gain to zero. " that means it´s a Political Action, and by that The Shadolands Horde couldn´t play it?

That one action of the Dark Lord's Favor card is Political, yes. That doesn't, however, make the entire card Political. Just that one action. A Shadowlands player can use the other three actions on that card, but not the honor gain reducing one.

Most of the discussion of new targetting rules has focused on the fact that reactions affecting a single card are targetted, and the untidy question of what exactly some of the "targetted by default" actions are targetting...

But did anyone notice this change?

"You may not target your bowed personalities with YOUR actions." (second YOUR added)

Well, I've noticed it *now*.

This has a couple of major implications. For one, you can (in fact, must if everyone is bowed) choose a bowed personality to stay for someone else's Encircled Terrain.

True. Also now true for Mountains of the Phoenix and the 12th Black Scroll. Also worked into that ruling is the fact that actions that specificall target bowed personalities cannot target your own bowed personalities, unless the action happens to be one that straightens your personality. Specifically, Touch of Death (which used to be legal to use on your own bowed soldiers) is no longer a legal action to use on your own personalities.

For another, it means that Yogo Asami becomes near-useless, since a player can target one of his or her bowed personalities with the effect. Bah. Rules lawyering. Well, Open's near-dead anyway.

Umm...that's not true. When an effect forces you to bow something, you cannot fulfill the requirement by 're-bowing' cards that are already bowed. Bowing can be a cost, a forced change, or the result of an action. In all of those cases, you cannot claim to 'bow' an already bowed personality to skip the normal bowing procedure.

Tow follow-up questions on those new targetting rules, I know you guys can help me.

Aw...shucks.

Does One Life, One Action target the card it is played upon. (My guess: yes)

Here's the text:

Reaction: Play this card immediately after another player resolves an action card from his or her hand. The player cannot play any copy of that action for the rest of the game, but the player can still use it for its focus value.

I'm going to say that no, OLOA doesn't target. There's a grey area in the description of the targeting rules with respect to Reactions. When a Reaction's trigger event happens, it's legal to play. However, by a strict reading of the four targeting rules, the Reaction has to target. My question is, what's it targeting? Can you target the end of a players attack phase, or the start of someone's turn? I really don't think so.

I think OLOA falls into that category, the group of Reactions that triggers off of game events and don't affect cards in play. There's got to be a solid way to draw the line on Reactions/targeting, and so far, I think the 'in play' idea seems to fit.

At least, that's my line for the next 24 hours or so. Let me ask Jeff for clarification, and I'll have more on this in my next post.

Can you cancel the OLOA with Agasha Hamanari? (My guess: yes)

Maybe. Ask me tomorrow.

Any other nifty surprises awaiting us from this change?

Tons.

Is the Gold Edition card "Deathseeker Technique" the same or a different card than the similarly but not identically named Soul of the Empire card "Death-Seeker Technique"?

Same card. Hyphenated words count the same as a non-hyphenated version of the same word. Page 33, Gold rulebook.

From the rules archive...

Poison Dartgun a.. The ranged attack originates from the Dartgun, not the Personality. It may be combined with other Dartguns or a ranged attack from the Personality. [DW, e-mail, 19 February 1999] Now, the questions. Does this mean that if the personality is capable of producing a ranged attack, the personality can use the dartgun to increase the attack and allow him/her to "shoot past" followers?

Technically, the Dartgun would be using the personality to hit a bigger target after it had already shot past the followers, but yeah, it's legal to combine the Ranged Attack from, say, a Ninja Mukami and the Poison Dartgun.

What if the personality has followers capable of creating ranged attacks, how do these combine with the dartgun?

As normal. You use the traits of the Ranged Attack from the card that initially created it, and the you can use other Ranged Attacks on cards in the same unit to increase the RA value.

Hello all again, Bayushi Yojiro's new wording states that he only provides +1 personal honor to personalities that are under your control, and no longer provides the bonus to all of your scorpion personalities. So, here is the question. When exactly do you gain honor for playing an aligned personality at full price? If you gain it as you play the personality, than the bonus does not yet apply and you don't get any extra honor. If you get the bonus immediatly after they are put in play, then the bonus applies and and you get an extra honor. I have been stumped on this one since ever since someone pointed out the MRP to me. Any help would be appreciated.

You gain the honor after they enter play. By precedent with Toturi and Hiruma Abun, modifications to their personal honor *will* change how much you're going to gain from paying full price for them.

Can you play White Shore Plain out of The Armor of Sun Tao without gold cost?

Nope. The Armor doesn't say that it changes the normal play of the terrain in any other way than destroying any terrain currently in play and making the Armored one indestructible. You still have to pay any costs associated with normal play of the terrain.

In a message dated 01-07-18 05:37:26 EDT, the splendiferous Vaughn wrote:

<< Something that reacts to a trigger event (Counterattack, The Wind's Truth, The Emperor's Left Hand) probably doesn't target.

Okay, I'll be the first to admit that the new targeting rules are still more than a bit unclear to me, but I don't see how this can be true. Don't all these fall under the "All other effects target" clause? (TWT in particular always *has* targeted, to my knowledge, since you had to target a player to redirect the honor to...) In each case, it's likely to be a targeted player, not card in play, and therefore likely irrelevant, but it seems to me that Targeting Rule #4 should apply. Can you explain (in small words, please <grin>) why it doesn't?

Well, I'll try. Mostly, I'm just answering the questions as I go. As much as anyone else is struggling with this new rule, I'm struggling as well. I just don't see how a Reaction can target a moment in time. Up until now, the definition of targeting has pretty much referred exclusively to cards and players currently somewhere in the game. The new rules might change that a bit, but I really don't believe that they change it *so* much that an instant should become a targetable 'thing'. I might be wrong, but I'm really just trying right now to fit this new rule in my head with my vision of the framework for targeting. Target an item? Sure. Target a Spell? Yeah. Target a personality? Definitely. Target a moment in time? I'm not so sure.

While I'm here, I have another question of my own. Is a Personality in play when they are being paid for, and therefore able to take reactions (that are legal, anyway)? For example, if I were to use corrupt gold to buy Goshiu (or Kaukatsu, if you prefer), could I immediately copy the honor loss to an opponent?

No. Payment happens before the personality enters play. Honor gains and losses from the personality entering play, though, do happen *after* the personality enters play. So, Jama Suru (who has a 3 point loss, I believe) can Wind's Truth his own honor loss as a Reaction to entering play.

And another question about the Dartgun.

By the archive, I believe that you can use the Dartgun while its Personality is bowed.

Yes?

Yes.

Rule 4. All other effects target. As a general guideline (because this is *so* different from the way that Reactions were previously handled), if a Reaction affects a card in play, assume that it targets unless it specifically says otherwise (Poisoned Weapon, for ex). Something that reacts to a trigger event (Counterattack, The Wind's Truth, The Emperor's Left Hand) probably doesn't target. This rule is going to take a while to work out, but will probably be stabler in the long run.

Then the question becomes: Does it target the card creating the duel, your personality entering the duel, or both?

Enough Talk? It targets both personalities, the one that you pick to challenge the offending talker, and the offending talker themselves.

Hi

Hi!

I have a quick question about Nemesis and Be Prepared to Dig Two Graves and their interaction with the Keyword Rule (pg 33 Gold Rulebook).

When you have used the above actions and targeted "a Personality" your opponent controls do all copies of that personality then trigger the secondary effects of the cards mentioned.

No, just the one that you targeted.

In other words does use of Nemesis or Be Prepared to Dig Two Graves create a situation were a Personalities name becomes a Keyword for the purposes of looking for it?

No, no more than Biting Steel creates a situation where all 'keyword' personalities gain +2/+2. You target a guy, that guy becomes a nemesis (Hi Hawke!). It's not a general case situation.