A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.
A player, 12 April 2010
Can someone exlpain why a force penalty overkill is counted for a 'set' interaction but not a 'bonus' interaction?
ex. 'Set'
Houhou is 2F. A -4F penalty is applied, dropping Houhou to 0F.
Houhou then has Force set @ 5 (which means 'apply bonus or penalty' to reach 5)... we have rulings that say you count the full -4, apply a 7F bonus and Houhou would then have 9F after the penalty expires.
However... if all set means is 'apply bonus or penalty'... why does this (to my knowledge) work completely differently than giving Houhou a flat force bonus?
Ex. 'Flat Bonus'
Houhou is 2F. A -4F penalty is applied, dropping Houhou to 0F.
Houhou then has a +5F bonus applied. The 'Set' ruling implies that when a bonus is applied you count prior overkill penalties, which would make Houhou 3F after the +5F bonus. But this is not how it works. Houhou is 5F after the flat bonus.
So... why are we counting the overkill for one interaction that effectively works a permanent flat bonus but not counting the overkill when we are applying a flat bonus? Why does 'Set' require +7F to reach 5 when a flat bonus only requires +5F?
Unless we do count overkill in all cases... but... I don't think I have ever seen anyone do that.
Edit: I can logically understand why an overkill caused by tokens would be counted as they constantly assert their effect. What is giving me hangups is the disparity between how non-token effects are handled.
Dan Jacobson (rules official), 12 April 2010
Can someone exlpain why a force penalty overkill is counted for a 'set' interaction but not a 'bonus' interaction?
ex. 'Set'
Houhou is 2F. A -4F penalty is applied, dropping Houhou to 0F.
Houhou then has Force set @ 5 (which means 'apply bonus or penalty' to reach 5)... we have rulings that say you count the full -4, apply a 7F bonus and Houhou would then have 9F after the penalty expires.
However... if all set means is 'apply bonus or penalty'... why does this (to my knowledge) work completely differently than giving Houhou a flat force bonus?
Ex. 'Flat Bonus'
Houhou is 2F. A -4F penalty is applied, dropping Houhou to 0F.
Houhou then has a +5F bonus applied. The 'Set' ruling implies that when a bonus is applied you count prior overkill penalties, which would make Houhou 3F after the +5F bonus. But this is not how it works. Houhou is 5F after the flat bonus.
So... why are we counting the overkill for one interaction that effectively works a permanent flat bonus but not counting the overkill when we are applying a flat bonus? Why does 'Set' require +7F to reach 5 when a flat bonus only requires +5F?
Unless we do count overkill in all cases... but... I don't think I have ever seen anyone do that.
Edit: I can logically understand why an overkill caused by tokens would be counted as they constantly assert their effect. What is giving me hangups is the disparity between how non-token effects are handled.
To "Set" a stat to a certain value implies not only a bonus/penalty, but it also accounts for bonuses and penalties already active on the personality.
A mere stat bonus or stat penalty does not do this.
That is the distinction made between setting a stat to a value and giving a stat bonus/penalty.