A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.
A player, 29 January 2010
Hi,
Echoes of Disgrace Battle: Target a dishonorably dead Personality owned by the enemy leader. Target one to three of his Personalities. You may dishonor one of them. Give them each a force penalty equal to the force of the dishonorably dead Personality.
Regarding this card, if the dishonored personality received force penalties at the current battle and was destroyed, does the force penalty applied by Echoes of Disgrace target the base force of the dishonorably dead personality? or does it include the force penalties previously applied to it prior to being dishonorably dead (during the same attack phase, if applicable)?
Thanks,
Togashi Azrael
Zen Faulkes (rules official), 29 January 2010
If the dishonored personality received force penalties at the current battle and was destroyed, does the force penalty applied by Echoes of Disgrace target the base force of the dishonorably dead personality?
Such bonuses are usually ongoing effects. http://rules.l5r.com/CE_Effects#Effects ... ut_of_play: "Ongoing effects on a card in play persist when the card leaves play(.)" So current value is used since Echoes of Disgrace doesn't specify base.