Discretionary Valor and Shame Never Dies

L5R CCG Rules board, 12 July 2009 to 2 September 2009

A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.

A player, 12 July 2009

My opponent sends home a dishonored personality using Discretionary Valor.

Can I still react with Shame Never Dies because the personality went home dishonored and became rehonored when it hit home?

Zen Faulkes (rules official), 12 July 2009

My opponent sends home a dishonored personality using Discretionary Valor. Can I still react with Shame Never Dies(?)

Yes. The action moved home a dishonorable Personality. Shame Never Dies does not care how the Personality was moved, nor happened after that.

A player, 2 September 2009

A quick question regarding this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=59&t=77413&p=1015480&hilit=Shame+Never+Dies#p1015480

If I send home a personality with Ramifications and they seppuku the honor loss may I still play Shame Never Dies?

Thank You!

Zen Faulkes (rules official), 2 September 2009

If I send home a personality with Ramifications and they seppuku the honor loss may I still play Shame Never Dies?

Yes. Effects occur in order, so with Ramifications, movement occurs before seppuku does. If movement happened, Shame Never Dies can be played.