The maws grave and losing honor.

L5R CCG Rules board, 24 September 2007

A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.

A player, 24 September 2007

The Maw's Grave + by hliguori on Mon Sep 24, 2007 4:10 pm

Hi there...

can a player using 'The Maw's Grave' pay the honor cost on an action, like: - Arrival of the Obsidian Champion (Open: Lose 3 Honor. Dishonor one of your target Personalities with a Gold Cost of 9 or greater. Permanently set his Force to 10 and his Chi to 2. Permanently give him Shadowlands and the ability, "Fear Battle: Bow each Follower with 4 or less Force in a target unit.") - Fight Another Day (Battle: Lose 2 Honor. Move home, then straighten, all units in your army. If this moved a Nonhuman, draw a card.) - and others...

because this stronghold have this text: "...You do not gain or lose Honor...."hliguori Regular

Posts: 52 Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 6:35 am Private messageWebsiteMSNM/WLM Top -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Re: The Maw's Grave + by Zen Faulkes on Mon Sep 24, 2007 9:17 pm

hliguori wrote: (C)an a player using 'The Maw's Grave' pay the honor cost on an action(?) No. http://rules.l5r.com/Glossary_D#Do_not

elaborate for me please. By my reading of the definition, it does not state that you cannot pay this cost, it just doesn't happen. If, by chance, it said, you ''cannot'' lose or gain honor. Then yes, since you can't then you aren't allowed. I would read the maws grave as saying, well I lose the honor, but I really don't, then the action continues. Because, that would mean that I could not put into play any shadowlands personality that said, '' lose X honor'' because I cannot pay that cost. By the rule book, you must pay all cost for putting into play a personality, be it honor requirement, gold, discarding a card, destroying a personality, or losing honor. I don't mean this in a rude tone, I just want to be perfectly clear. Thank you for your time.

Chris Fuchs (rules official), 24 September 2007

A cost is usually a change to the state or stats of a card, player or other game entity. A cost must fully occur, or be “paid,” for effects of an action or trait to happen, or for a card with a cost to enter play.

Also see the addition to your initial question located viewtopic.php?f=59&t=61989 .

You seem to be mixing "costs" with "effects". Personalities with an entering play honor loss have honor loss effects. Your actions given as examples have honor loss effects.