Bayushi Saya Targeting Herself follow-up and resolving actio

L5R CCG Rules board, 3 August 2007 to 14 August 2007

A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.

A player, 3 August 2007

http://www.alderac.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=59979

Bayushi Saya Political Open: Target a Personality. After the next time this turn his controller assigns him or an action resolves that he performed, his controller loses Honor equal to his Personal Honor, then he is dishonored.

From the Comprehensive Rules about Abilities and Actions E. Action ends The trigger “the action resolves” is the same point in time as “the action ends.”

Emphases mine

If resolving an action is the same point in time as the action ending, how is it not instantaneous? In regards to Saya, wouldn't the moment she ends her action (targeting herself) be the trigger to cause her to dishonor herself?

Just trying to understand. I can see what you mean by running a race not being a specific point in time, but it appears to me that "resolving" is not equivalent to "running a race" but rather "finishing a race".

Thank you in advance.

Martin Lund (rules official), 3 August 2007

http://www.alderac.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=59979

Bayushi Saya Political Open: Target a Personality. After the next time this turn his controller assigns him or an action resolves that he performed, his controller loses Honor equal to his Personal Honor, then he is dishonored.

From the Comprehensive Rules about Abilities and Actions E. Action ends The trigger “the action resolves” is the same point in time as “the action ends.”

Emphases mine

If resolving an action is the same point in time as the action ending, how is it not instantaneous? In regards to Saya, wouldn't the moment she ends her action (targeting herself) be the trigger to cause her to dishonor herself?

Just trying to understand. I can see what you mean by running a race not being a specific point in time, but it appears to me that "resolving" is not equivalent to "running a race" but rather "finishing a race".

Thank you in advance.

I already made the ruling.

If you are already in the middle of Resolving and Action then that Action does not count for "the next time an action resolves," in its own effects. This time is "this time," not "the next time."

I'll see about clarifying that line of the Comprehensive Rules to be more accurate. "Before an action resolves," triggers before any effects. That entry might mislead people to believing that it triggers after the action's effects resolve but before any "after an action resolves," Reactions could be played - which is just silly considering step D is titled specifically "D. Action resolves."

"D. Action resolves" specifically outlines a process to be followed, and in many cases involves a sequence of effects and Reactions to those effects. It can certainly not function as it if were instantaneous.

Martin Lund (rules official), 14 August 2007

Update - Roger's updated the Glossary definition of "Next" to clarify what's going on. The Ruling stands that Saya's Action doesn't trigger itself on resolution.

- Marty Lund Deputy Rules Monkey