Shadow Dragon

L5R CCG Rules board, 1 April 2005 to 2 April 2005

A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from the Wayback Machine (its copy), so posts it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.

A player, 1 April 2005
Jeff Alexander wrote:

PopeJubal wrote:

wrote:

Hidden Heart of Iuchiban exp

I steal a personality with the Hidden Heart and the personality dies somehow. I play Feign Death to bring him back from the dead. I am now the permanent controller of the personality just like with Show+Feign. If it were not for the line at the end of the Hidden Heart exp, I'd keep him until the end of the game (or at least until he dies or is stolen by my opponent).

The final line says that, "The player this effect took him from gains control of him at the end of the turn".

All effects that do not list a duration last until the end of the turn.

The "Tptethfgcohateott" clause does not state a duration, so that control would last only until the end of the turn according to the rules as written. Who gets to keep this personality over the long haul?

I can't speak for Designer Intent, but I'm guessing that this final effect was supposed to be permanent.

It is permanent. Changing of controllers is permanent by default [archive], as are all positional and zone changes. (A Personality that's destroyed or shuffled back into a deck doesn't return to play when the turn ends. A unit sent home from battle doesn't move back to that Province when the turn ends. Etc.)

The final line that says "The player this effect took him from gains control of him at the end of the turn" is an actual effect of the card, not a reminder. (Reminders are written in italics and within parentheses, like this.) The card is written this way because Show of Good Faith taught us some conceptual problems with making state changes, such as changing controllers, temporary.

Shadow Dragon does not list a duration for taking control of the personality he steals. Does that mean the Shadow Dragon's theft is permanent?

Zen Faulkes (rules official), 2 April 2005

Does that mean the Shadow Dragon's theft is permanent?

Yes.