A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from the Wayback Machine (its copy), so posts it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.
Hi everyone !
If I play Savagery of the Moto and switch one of my regions with one of my opponent's and destroy his province (where I switched regions), what happens to both regions ?
A. They stay where they are (one is discarded, originaly mine, and one is attached to my province, originaly my opponent's) ?
B. They re-switch after the battle no matter what (his region going to the discard and mine attaching to my province) ?
Hi everyone !
If I play Savagery of the Moto and switch one of my regions with one of my opponent's and destroy his province (where I switched regions), what happens to both regions ?
A. They stay where they are (one is discarded, originaly mine, and one is attached to my province, originaly my opponent's) ?
B. They re-switch after the battle no matter what (his region going to the discard and mine attaching to my province) ?
This question is answered in the Rules Archive under "Savagery of Moto."
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Sorry but the statement is not clear enough for me:
"Does not return a Region that was destroyed back into play when the battle ends. [JA, email, 7 December 2004] "
What happens to the remaining region then ? Does it remain where it is ? Does it go back to the lost province therefore going directly in the discard pile ?
What happens to the remaining region then ? Does it remain where it is ? Does it go back to the lost province therefore going directly in the discard pile ?
Ah. See Rules Archive, Joining and changing controllers. Though Regions aren't changing controllers in this case, the same general idea applies: If something can't go back, it stays where it is. See also Marty Lund's rules post for 1 December 2004.
I have a question in response to this, if i play Savagery of the Moto and switch my Plains of tosan Uchi for my opponents Musume Mura and destroy the current province. I would retain usage of my opponents Musume Mura, correct? And, who would lose the 10 honor for Plains of Otosan Uchi, me the current controller, or my opponent because his province was destroyed while Plains of Otasan Uchi was destroyed. Thank you for your response.
I have a question in response to this, if i play Savagery of the Moto and switch my Plains of tosan Uchi for my opponents Musume Mura and destroy the current province. I would retain usage of my opponents Musume Mura, correct?
Savagery of Moto
Battle: If you are a Unicorn Clan player, target a Personality you do not control in the current battle and a Personality with the same controller at a different location. Switch their locations. Battle: Target a Region you control and a Region attached to the current Province. Move them to each others' Provinces until the battle ends.
Nowhere does it say you gain control of the region that is now attached to your province. Unless I am mistaken, you never had control of their Region in the first place.
Quote:
I have a question in response to this, if i play Savagery of the Moto and switch my Plains of tosan Uchi for my opponents Musume Mura and destroy the current province. I would retain usage of my opponents Musume Mura, correct?
Nowhere does it say you gain control of the region that is now attached to your province. Unless I am mistaken, you never had control of their Region in the first place.
I never asked if i gained control, i asked if i would keep usage of it... i dont know if i will, that is why i am asking a question to a rules person, and if it becomes a blank region, than its easier for me to break
I never asked if i gained control, i asked if i would keep usage of it...
You can't use what you do not control (Diamond rules, pg. 55). (Edit: Make that page 99.)
Okay, let's say that, while I was attacking, I use Savagery of the Moto to swap one of my Regions for my opponent's Utaku Meadows. Then, I take the province. During his turn, would my opponent still be able to use Utaku Meadows to make follower tokens?
Also what about that one Shinsei's Shrine ? if I Savagry that do i now not refill the province ?
Also what about that one Shinsei's Shrine ? if I Savagry that do i now not refill the province ?
The answer to the previous two questions is in the Diamond rulebook glosdsary, page 99 (which should have been the reference to my earlier answer, sorry).
So, basicly what your saying is when the regions are switched and one is destroyed,the original controler retains control and usage although its now attached to the other players provence by default. The one who's provence it is attached to treats it as a blank region, while the controler can still use its abilities.
In the case of Plains of Otosan Uchi. If its destroyed while attached to another players provence, no one looses honor as its no longer attached to the provence it originaly refrenced. Durring that battle the other player does not add the second card to that provence from the switch, While the originator immediately discards one from it no longer being there.
Is this correct?
In the case of Plains of Otosan Uchi.
From Marty's 14 December rules post:
"'If Savagery is used by the attacker to switch Plains of OU into the
defender's province, and this province is then destroyed, who loses the 10 Honour? I think it's the attacker, since he would still control the Plains regardless of where they are, and the text of Plains doesn't give any reason to suppose that anyone other than their controller would suffer the honour loss.'
"Correct conclusion. Correct explanation."