Whose players effect is it when my opponent takes the action given by my accessible terrain? Or to be more precise does my summon water kami negate the movements of my opponnent when he takes the action granted by my accissble terrain?
Given abilities and effect's source; Summon Water Kami
A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.
Whose players effect is it when my opponent takes the action given by my accessible terrain? Or to be more precise does my summon water kami negate the movements of my opponnent when he takes the action granted by my accissble terrain?
This follows with the rules on "from". The determination of whose effect it is comes from the card granting the effect; therefore, if my opponent has played Accessible Terrain, and I attempt to use the player ability it grants me, it is still considered to be his effect.
From here: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=113020 2 questions: Does Summon Water Kami stop Favor Send home?
Water Battle: You may bow this Shugenja. If he bowed or if he is Water, negate other players' effects that move units to or from this battlefield. Destroy this Spell.
The favor ability is coming from the rulebook; does this count as being from the player?
"The source is the card that the effect, action or targeting is printed on, or the rulebook if it is printed there."
But under the comprehensive rules, I'm not finding the wording on the Favor Battle rule. Does it state that it is a player's effect, or a rulebook effect? If a rulebook effect, is it also an effect of the player who is taking the action? (ie: Does taking an action from the rulebook make it that player's action? or does the rulebook create player abilities, the actions of which, when taken, become that players?
Further the example under "possessive case" uses the example:
When referring to actions (as distinct from abilities), the possessive case refers to the player who took the action, regardless of the owner or controller of a card it is on.
Example: If a player is able to take an action from an ability on one of your cards, the effects come from that player’s action, but come from your cards and are your card effects.
Which is very close to applying directly to accessible terrain; though it is a trait on accessible and not an ability that grant's each player an ability. So we see its a card effect.
The particular possessive case summon water kami is looking for is a "player's effect," and not a "card effect."
Essentially: at what time is an effect, a player's effect? We have here an example that it is not simply when a player takes an action, as the effect is shown to be the player's who played accessible terrain. If the rulebook favor action is also a player ability, does it then follow that it is a rulebook effect or a player effect?
If it is both a rulebook effect and a player effect (thereby being stopped by summon water kami), how does the ability granted by accessible terrain not also become a card effect and a player effect, albeit in the example above the card effect and player effect belonging to two different players?
From here: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=113020 2 questions: Does Summon Water Kami stop Favor Send home?
The favor ability is coming from the rulebook; does this count as being from the player?
"The source is the card that the effect, action or targeting is printed on, or the rulebook if it is printed there."
But under the comprehensive rules, I'm not finding the wording on the Favor Battle rule. Does it state that it is a player's effect, or a rulebook effect? If a rulebook effect, is it also an effect of the player who is taking the action? (ie: Does taking an action from the rulebook make it that player's action? or does the rulebook create player abilities, the actions of which, when taken, become that players?
Further the example under "possessive case" uses the example:
Which is very close to applying directly to accessible terrain; though it is a trait on accessible and not an ability that grant's each player an ability. So we see its a card effect.
The particular possessive case summon water kami is looking for is a "player's effect," and not a "card effect."
Essentially: at what time is an effect, a player's effect? We have here an example that it is not simply when a player takes an action, as the effect is shown to be the player's who played accessible terrain. If the rulebook favor action is also a player ability, does it then follow that it is a rulebook effect or a player effect?
If it is both a rulebook effect and a player effect (thereby being stopped by summon water kami), how does the ability granted by accessible terrain not also become a card effect and a player effect, albeit in the example above the card effect and player effect belonging to two different players?
The Rules Team has been discussing this further.
When an action I take creates an action, the effects of that action are mine, regardless of where the ability is or whose card it is on - whose card determines whether its "my card effect" or "your card effect", but not if it's "my effect" or "your effect".
Thus, if you cast Summon Water Kami, my effects - that is, effects of actions I take - will not move units to or from the current battlefield, regardless of whether the action is from my Accessible Terrain's granted ability, your Accessible Terrain's granted ability or the rulebook's Favor Battle ability.