A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.
A player, 23 May 2014
I'm getting confused about what "Invest XG" exactly means. Following this example http://www.l5r.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=108288&sid=1e92e9e28ec045b1a4176acea35890d0 and Comprehensive Rules it's additional separate cost in case of Strategies and only gold cost modification while talking about Personalities, Holdings and attachments. On the other hand Ide Aragaki's text suggest that invest is totally separate cost distinctive from card's cost, which, according to CR, appears to be true only for strategies. So does it mean Aragaki can only pay for Strategies Invests?
Other aspect of this is connected to Investing with Personalities copied by EoPK exp. Once again according to CR definition of invest
When paying for a card entering play, a player may increase its Gold cost by the additional cost in its Invest trait, once, to get an additional effect after it enters play
it appears that Invest is just a modification of Created copy Gold Cost (which is 0 by default for created cards), but, again according to CR:
Gold Cost: A stat on many cards; also, as “Gold cost,” the amount that must be paid for an action, including Equip or Recruit. See Costs, p. 15. For Gold Costs and Personalities, see p. 9.
it does not matter as created cards are neither Equipped not Recruited, so this Gold Cost modification does not matter. So it appears that I got this Invest for free.
It seems that Invest mechanics was pretty much damaged during "rules simplification" in IvE. While it was completely separate cost back in EE it has to morph into cost modification in IvE, where everything is supposed to be action, so only cost player can play during Recruit is cost of Dynasty action. This simply cannot work with Aragaki's wording (and players habits from last 19 years of L5R ^^). Anyway maybe it's not right place for this, but I'm getting an impression that IvE rules are getting more and more inconsistent.
edit. Also Advanced Rulebook and Comprehensive Rules contradict each other with definition of Invest
Invest: This is a trait that starts with “Invest” and a Gold cost (for example, “Invest :”). After a card with Invest is played, you may pay the additional cost in the Invest trait, once, to get an additional effect (for example, “Gain 1 Honor” or “Give this card a +1F token.”)
Invest: This is a trait that starts with “Invest” and a Gold cost (for example, “Invest (2):”). When paying for a card entering play, a player may increase its Gold cost by the additional cost in its Invest trait, once, to get an additional effect after it enters play (for example, “Gain 1 Honor” or “Give this card a +2F token.”) Things that can pay for the card type entering play can also pay for the Invest cost. However, when Invest appears on a non-Strategy card, its effects come from the Invest trait, not the action that brought the card into play.
edit. 2 There is another question from my side. We know two forms of additional cost on strategies invest and discipline. Are they separate costs or rather "cost modifications"? For example, so far there is no invest Strategy with cost greater than 2, but assume there is such - 4GC Invest on strategy. Can I reduce this cost by 3 with Kaeru's Contractor? Same question with discipline.
Ben Higgins (rules official), 30 June 2014
I'm getting confused about what "Invest XG" exactly means. Following this example http://www.l5r.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=108288&sid=1e92e9e28ec045b1a4176acea35890d0 and Comprehensive Rules it's additional separate cost in case of Strategies and only gold cost modification while talking about Personalities, Holdings and attachments. On the other hand Ide Aragaki's text suggest that invest is totally separate cost distinctive from card's cost, which, according to CR, appears to be true only for strategies. So does it mean Aragaki can only pay for Strategies Invests?
Other aspect of this is connected to Investing with Personalities copied by EoPK exp. Once again according to CR definition of invest
it appears that Invest is just a modification of Created copy Gold Cost (which is 0 by default for created cards), but, again according to CR:
it does not matter as created cards are neither Equipped not Recruited, so this Gold Cost modification does not matter. So it appears that I got this Invest for free.
It seems that Invest mechanics was pretty much damaged during "rules simplification" in IvE. While it was completely separate cost back in EE it has to morph into cost modification in IvE, where everything is supposed to be action, so only cost player can play during Recruit is cost of Dynasty action. This simply cannot work with Aragaki's wording (and players habits from last 19 years of L5R ^^). Anyway maybe it's not right place for this, but I'm getting an impression that IvE rules are getting more and more inconsistent.
edit. Also Advanced Rulebook and Comprehensive Rules contradict each other with definition of Invest
edit. 2 There is another question from my side. We know two forms of additional cost on strategies invest and discipline. Are they separate costs or rather "cost modifications"? For example, so far there is no invest Strategy with cost greater than 2, but assume there is such - 4GC Invest on strategy. Can I reduce this cost by 3 with Kaeru's Contractor? Same question with discipline.
First to address the issue of the Advanced Rulebook vs the Comprehensive Rules. As the CR is a living document (i.e. it is designed to evolve and grow with the card pool), it takes precedence over the Advanced Rulebook, which can only reflect the game's state at a fixed point in time.
Next, when increasing a cards cost via Invest, you are indeed modifying base cost, but that modification is still considered an Invest cost, so Ide Aragaki can use her gold production to help pay for all or part of that increase. Since that gold is earmarked for a single Invest cost only however, if the Invest cost is less than Aragaki's Personal Honor any left over gold cannot be used for the base gold cost, another card's gold cost, nor another card's Invest cost.
Finally, with regards to Egg of P'an Ku and how it interacts with Invest traits on the Personality that the Egg copies: Unfortunately, I'll have to mark this as Under Discussion.
Ben Higgins (rules official), 30 June 2014
Aaaaand we're back!!
You cannot use an Invest trait on a Personality created by the Egg of P'an Ku - Experienced.
If the Egg of P'an Ku XP is copying a Personality with an Invest trait, the additional cost of the Invest trait would have to be announced and applied when the player would pay any costs associated with the Limited ability on the Egg. At that point in the action sequence however, the created card does not exist yet, and therefore cannot be triggered.