Tamori Takeshi and Step Through the Void

L5R CCG Rules board, 19 November 2012 to 20 February 2013

A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.

A player, 19 November 2012

If I use Tamori Takeshi to target a Shugenja who has an entering-play Reaction, and then use Step Through the Void on that Shugenja, does Takeshi's ability allow me to take the entering-play Reaction that would otherwise be ignored? The consolidated rules use the expression 'effects... are prevented' and the section on Prevention under effects suggests that the default form of prevention is negation.

Battle/Open: Destroy this card unless this Shugenja is Void: Remove this Shugenja from the game; his attachments stay attached. Before this turn ends, put his unit into play, ignoring costs, entering-play effects, and restrictions.

Open: Target your Personality: Takeshi helps him meditate. Effects of actions the target performs will not be negated.

Entering-play effects An entering-play effect is one that is triggered by a card entering play, either as part of a Reaction, a triggered trait, or a conditional triggered effect. The phrase "ignoring entering-play effects," in the context of cards entering play, means that all effects dependent on the trigger of those cards entering play are prevented, whether they belong to Reactions, traits, or conditional effects. Reactions can still be taken to those cards entering play, but without effect. [Section ADDED 13 Jun 2012]

Prevention (including negation) Some effects prevent or end changes to the game state caused by other effects or costs, either by explicit wording such as “do not” and “will not”, or by negation. The term "occurrences" is used here to include effects, choices, and costs which might be prevented.

Jon Palmer (rules official), 1 February 2013

If I use Tamori Takeshi to target a Shugenja who has an entering-play Reaction, and then use Step Through the Void on that Shugenja, does Takeshi's ability allow me to take the entering-play Reaction that would otherwise be ignored? The consolidated rules use the expression 'effects... are prevented' and the section on Prevention under effects suggests that the default form of prevention is negation.

Under discussion - apologies for missing this first time around.

A player, 20 February 2013

http://www.alderac.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=100614

Any final word on this?

Thanks,

A player, 20 February 2013

Apologies for the delay.

Step through the Void prevents the entering-play effects. All negation effects are prevention effects, but not all prevention effects are negation effects. In this particular instance, "ignoring entering-play effects" is prevention but not negation, it's stronger. "Ignore" has been defined as follows:

An effect that ignores another effect prevents it from happening. [ADDED Jan 12 2013]

An effect that ignores a restriction removes it as a requirement. [ADDED Jan 12 2013]

An effect that ignores a cost removes the requirement to pay it. See Changes to costs and payments.

(Emphasis mine) Tamori Takeshi's phrasing "may not be negated" doesn't trump all prevention, just negation, so it'd fail to prevent Step Through the Void's prevention.

You still can't react with the personality's entering-play Reaction.