Rulings for 8 February 2001

Fun fact

Guys, Didja ever notice that Otaku Tetsuko is not a member of the Unicorn Clan? I mean she's a Unicorn Battle Maiden*Samuai*Cavalry and all, but not a Unicorn _Clan_ Battle Maiden*Samurai*Cavalry. I've done a random sampling of all other clans, and each of them, even the Dragon Clan, always uses the "clan" keyword. I'm sure you'll fix this with an erratum, but it's not in the Rules Archive and I've had great fun making the local Unicorn guy go purple with frustration.

Well, bully for you. I guess.

Otaku Tetsuko is "Unicorn Clan". Soshi Jomyako is "Scorpion Clan". These are both official.

Toshiken and O-ushi

Toshiken vs O-Ushi and a headache

Timing wise Judgement of Toshiken is played after O ushi sensei kicks in, and also includes the statement that the duel's outcome is decided solely by chi plus focus values, ignoring all other effects... etc...

Now the question is does Judgement trump O ushi sensei?

No. This one is straight from the archives:

] Does not change a non-Chi duel to a duel of Chi. [ZF]

Also in a simular situation where neither personality has focused and judgement is played allowing each person to focus once, are these focuses played in normal order? (ie challenged person focusing first, barring tetsubos etc)

I thought this one was in the archives, but I can't find it. Go clockwise, starting with the active player, to find the one who makes the new focus first.

Since it's a conditional focus, may I still legally take an action that is considered "focusing" such as playing strike with flowing water or chi strike to destroy all the focuses? including those just focused via judgement.

Yes and yes.

Are these "extra" focuses face up or face down? if they are played face up and "not revealed" in a standard manner does it alter the effect of "another time"? (which wording wise seems dependant on actually being "revealed" which would be differant than being played face up)

All additional focuses, if any, are "revealed" after both players have chosen whether or not to take one.

Lastly if I have the ring of fire in play and use it's benefit to have my opponent play his focuses face up, does this likewise negate another time since it is never "revealed" *OR* does the duel immediatly end without resoulution as soon as the card is played. I guess what I'm asking is when exactly are focuses considered "revealed"?

Focuses are revealed in a distinct step after a player calls a strike. Even face-up focuses are not considered "revealed" until this time.

Kaiu Sensei question.

Alright..I was thinking, since the Kaiu sensei allows all your fortifications to act as if they were in every province, then destroying one province will destroy ALL fortifications they have, correct? Or am I just not thinking clearly on this one?

You are not correct. Their abilities can be used during battles at all Provinces, and their traits are in effect, as though the Fortifications were everywhere, but they are not actually present. They cannot be destroyed with things like Firebreathers and they are not destroyed if the Province is. (Barracks is an exception to this due entirely to its own text.)

Rules question

Fear's Bane.

Are Naga/the Spawning Grounds/etc. immune to it because of their immunity to Fear?

No. Fear has its own defintion, so the Foo Rule doesn't apply.

question about the big G

I must have missed some of the messages posted on this subject earlier...honestly I'm pretty tired of this whole Gaheris debate, but I need to know: what is the FINAL say on the Encircled Terrain/Osari Plains/Journaled Gaheris issue?

The Rules Team is still debating on this one. There IS no "FINAL say" yet.

Short question on Kolat Instigator

The card reads as follows - Kolat Instigator (R) 4G 2Fo Limited: Target a Personality who must issue a challenge to a Personality of his controller's choice. This challenge can be refused without penalty. Lose 2 Honor.

My question is - Can the controller of the targeted samurai select one of his other personalities to accept the dual and then refuse without penalty?

No. It is illegal for a player to issue a challenge between two of his own Personalities.

Final ruling on canceled actions

In a message dated 2/9/01 12:59:40 AM Pacific Standard Time, writes:

You know, *everyone* in the Rules Junta has said that the 'negate' part of Flee is a mistake due to card wording predating proper templating. *Everyone* has said it. Multiple times. In italics, even. With little starry things around it. In capital letters. Somehow, it never seems to make any difference. People just can't realize that...

So in the age of going by the cards text, and not necessarily intent, we are going to go by the cards intent, and not text when it comes to this?

Because this particular case needs it.

The rulebook says that an action which has been cancelled does not count as having been used. The rulebook also says that an action which has all its effects negated DOES count as having been used. So when something like Flee comes along and both cancels and negates, well...is the action used or not? It can't be both.

My old archive has an entry that tells how to resolve this conflict. Zen dutifully removed it from his in the interests of space when he learned that the rulebook finally defined the distinction between canceling an entire action versus just its effects, but he didn't realize that the rulebook's phrasing didn't cover the conflict. I've asked him to bring it back, and he has.

Until Gold Edition prints (and sources close to me tell me it's going to!), there's no practical difference between issuing errata on every card that "cancels and negates" and bringing back the old ruling. They're both just words on the net, and just as hard to get to.

Once Gold prints, though, updating the rulebook to match is my preferred course of action. MRPing Flee the Darkness only fixes one card. Issuing errata takes up space that doesn't need to be taken up.

O- Ushi vs Return for Training part 2

Okay, another good look at O- Ushi Sensei has revealed another question.

O- Ushi sensei "responds" to card actions which target my opponent's cards.

Return for Training breaks down into 2 clauses: 1 which does not target (the lowest personal honor human personality is sent home) and one which does (if there is a tie, you choose). When I play Return for Training when my opponent has the lowest personal honor personality, and there is only one, then he can not "activate" O- Ushi Sensei right, because his card is not being targeted?

False. If an action is ever targeted, it always is. Return for Training is a targeted action even if there's only one Personality it can be legally played on. It's the exact same situation as Block Supply Lines being played on a solitary attacker.

Second, I ask again, if there is a tie, what is the procedure for choosing a legal target?

The same as if there isn't a tie: the person playing it announces his target when he plays the card.

Will Return for Training always have a legal target? At what point during the process does having an illegal target negate the effects of the card?

When it resolves.

Okay, finally some questions about traits:

1. Is an action on a Kolat Card (say Chinoko's ability to reduce Kolat cards by 4 gold) considered Kolat actions?

If it's printed on the card or has been copied onto it, then yes.

2. Are Fire, Void, Air, Wind, Water and Earth actions considered to be Elemental actions?

No.

3. Is the Limited duelling action of Kolat Bodyguard considered a Kolat action, taken by the personality challenging the personality with Kolat Bodyguard?

It IS taken by the Personality bowing to issue the challenge, but it is not (necessarily) a Kolat action. To use Vaughn's term, it's a "floating action" -- it's something new that players can do but which isn't actually copied onto any of their cards.

2 Questions

Hello everyone. I wanted to write and ask a couple of questions.

1. Does White Shore Plain target the tacticians who have not used there tactician trait?

White Shore Plain does not target anything.

2. This is a timing Question concerning Forced March. If a defender plays a Counter Attack, resolves the Battle, and then plays Forced March to move one of the returning attackers to another of the opponents provinces, would that battle then be resolved or would it move back to the original attacker. Boy that was convoluted. Let me try to simplify so "I" understand what I just asked.

Player A is being attacked by Player B. Player B has assigned units to 2 of Player A's provinces. Player A defends both provinces with units. Player B resolves one of the battles his units are in. Player A wins the battle and counter attacks, sending all of the units at that battle to one of Player B's provinces.

Counterattack is not played until all the battles have resolved. Player A cannot play Counterattack here. I think that renders the rest of your example rather moot.

2 Questions

Sorry, but this is a long response to question 2.

Counterattack can only happen once all battles have resolved, not after just one battle. Therefore, all battles with B attacking A would resolve, then a chance to rally, then a counterattack by B. This Counterattack is not complete until all battles have resolved at Player A's provinces, so if player A had another counterattack, he'd have to wait until player B was done killing him. Therefore, the question is answered by the fact that Counterattack demands you wait until all battles have resolved; end of story.

However, you COULD have this situation with Shiryo no Tsuko. Let's say Player A attacks B, then B wins a battle with Shiryo no Tsuko's personality. An attack phase begins for player B at player A. In this case you could use forced march before letting player A get on with the rest of his attack. But, what would happen if player A then counterattacked the Shiryo no Tsuko attack of player B? There are already battles going on! Would this attack phase take place, disregarding currently in-place battles in player A's original attack phase? Or would this allow the player to assign additional units to current battles?

It looks as though all players are free to reassign their units any way they like. Once the Counterattack battles are over, resume the original attack where you left off, with any surviving units back in the battles they were in when the whole series of reactions started. Don't straighten any bowed cards, either. Units can find themselves fighting battles at Provinces which no longer exist.