Naval, Fearsome Mempo, and Utaku Jin-Lao

L5R CCG Rules board, 12 January 2011 to 13 January 2011

A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.

A player, 12 January 2011

Scenario: The opposing player attacks me w/ a naval personality w/ 2F (or less). I defend w/ Utaku Jin-Lao who is wearing Fearsome Mempo (or some other personality of mine at the battle). After engaging, my opponent reacts w/ the "naval" ability targeting his 2F personality. I then react w/ Fearsome mempo, lowering his force to zero. I then react to that force loss w/ jin-lao making him not able to perform actions. At this point we pass all other reactions and begin the combat. What happens? Since he has "navaled" his personality, he gets to take the first action but can't due to jin-lao, so he must pass correct? Just wasn't sure since Naval gives you the first chance to play a battle action but not necessarily to pass (though i assume passing is included in there)- I'm assuming this kind of scenario basically "negates" the naval ability since the Naval personality is unable to perform an action. The same scenario could be asked for Deathly Aura as well. I'm also asking this question with regards to Utaku Liu-Xeung even though I know you can't answer to that part .

Utaku Jin-Lao Reaction: After the resolution of an action that gave a Personality opposing Jin-lao a Force penalty, if the Personality's Force is now 0: Target the Personality. He may not perform actions.

Fearsome Mempo Reaction: After engaging in a battle: Give -2F to a target Personality or Follower opposing this card.

Naval Reaction: After engaging, once per battle, if you are the Attacker and your current army has more Naval cards than the side opposing it, target your Naval Personality: You have the first opportunity to take a Battle action, which must be performed by the targeted Personality.

Deathly Aura Reaction: After engaging, if you are the Attacker, choose your performing Samurai: You have the first chance to take a Battle action in this battle, which must be performed by that Samurai.

Zen Faulkes (rules official), 12 January 2011

Scenario: The opposing player attacks me w/ a naval personality w/ 2F (or less). I defend w/ Utaku Jin-Lao who is wearing Fearsome Mempo (or some other personality of mine at the battle). After engaging, my opponent reacts w/ the "naval" ability targeting his 2F personality. I then react w/ Fearsome mempo, lowering his force to zero. I then react to that force loss w/ jin-lao making him not able to perform actions. At this point we pass all other reactions and begin the combat. What happens? Since he has "navaled" his personality, he gets to take the first action but can't due to jin-lao, so he must pass correct? Just wasn't sure since Naval gives you the first chance to play a battle action but not necessarily to pass (though i assume passing is included in there)- I'm assuming this kind of scenario basically "negates" the naval ability since the Naval personality is unable to perform an action. The same scenario could be asked for Deathly Aura as well. I'm also asking this question with regards to Utaku Liu-Xeung even though I know you can't answer to that part .

Utaku Jin-Lao Reaction: After the resolution of an action that gave a Personality opposing Jin-lao a Force penalty, if the Personality's Force is now 0: Target the Personality. He may not perform actions.

Fearsome Mempo Reaction: After engaging in a battle: Give -2F to a target Personality or Follower opposing this card.

Naval Reaction: After engaging, once per battle, if you are the Attacker and your current army has more Naval cards than the side opposing it, target your Naval Personality: You have the first opportunity to take a Battle action, which must be performed by the targeted Personality.

Deathly Aura Reaction: After engaging, if you are the Attacker, choose your performing Samurai: You have the first chance to take a Battle action in this battle, which must be performed by that Samurai.

Having the opportunity to take an action does not require you to take one (extension from "additional": http://rules.l5r.com/CE_Glossary_A#Additional_action).

A player, 13 January 2011

As a follow up to this question: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=88327

Zen answered: "Having the opportunity to take an action does not require you to take one"

So, if I use the Naval Reaction on a 2F personality, and then my opponent the reacts with Fearsome Mempo and Utaku Jin-Lao, rendering my personality unable to perform actions, then I am forced to pass on the first action of the combat segment, correct? If that is the case, then if my opponent passes on his first action, is the battle over before I am ever able to take an action?

Zen Faulkes (rules official), 13 January 2011

So, if I use the Naval Reaction on a 2F personality, and then my opponent the reacts with Fearsome Mempo and Utaku Jin-Lao, rendering my personality unable to perform actions, then I am forced to pass on the first action of the combat segment, correct? If that is the case, then if my opponent passes on his first action, is the battle over before I am ever able to take an action?

http://rules.l5r.com/CE_Battles#B._Combat_Segment: "After all players pass in sequence, the Combat Segment ends and the battle proceeds to the Resolution Segment."

Sure looks that way.