A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.
A player, 6 November 2008
I know this has already been asked and answered but i was hoping the rules team would re-review it because it seems like such an obvious YES to me and there is no official card errata on the comprehensive rules website.
Old thread: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=61960&p=793237&hilit=a+noble+end#p793237
The rulebook says that when a card is destroyed, all cards attached to it are destroyed as well.
pg.17 of the Samurai Edition rule book:A Personality and all his or her attached cards make up a unit. If a Personality leaves play (for example, by being destroyed), all cards in the unit leave play in the same way. When a unit is targeted, this targets its Personality, not any other cards in the unit.
A Noble End reads: Battle: Target one of your unbowed Personalities: Target a number of Personalities or Followers opposing him up to his Personal Honor. Destroy each opposing target with 0 Force. Gain 2 Honor for each card destroyed. Give each opposing target still in play -2F.
The first sentence of the card sets the precedent that this cards effects are not limited to personalities alone (Target a number of Personalities or Followers). The biggest thing that I point to is the location of periods. "Gain 2 Honor for each card destroyed." is its own statement on the card with nothing linking it to the previous statement.
If it had been written,
"Target a number of Personalities or Followers opposing him up to his Personal Honor. Destroy each opposing target with 0 Force, gain 2 Honor for each card destroyed." OR "Target a number of Personalities or Followers opposing him up to his Personal Honor. Destroy each opposing target with 0 Force gaining 2 Honor for each card destroyed this way.
I could understand the confusion, but this seems very cut and dry to me. With the Championship weekend fast approaching I beg you rules kami to take a second look at this.
Zen Faulkes (rules official), 6 November 2008
I know this has already been asked and answered but i was hoping the rules team would re-review it because it seems like such an obvious YES to me and there is no official card errata on the comprehensive rules website.
Old thread: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=61960&p=793237&hilit=a+noble+end#p793237
The rulebook says that when a card is destroyed, all cards attached to it are destroyed as well.
pg.17 of the Samurai Edition rule book:A Personality and all his or her attached cards make up a unit. If a Personality leaves play (for example, by being destroyed), all cards in the unit leave play in the same way. When a unit is targeted, this targets its Personality, not any other cards in the unit.
A Noble End reads: Battle: Target one of your unbowed Personalities: Target a number of Personalities or Followers opposing him up to his Personal Honor. Destroy each opposing target with 0 Force. Gain 2 Honor for each card destroyed. Give each opposing target still in play -2F.
The first sentence of the card sets the precedent that this cards effects are not limited to personalities alone (Target a number of Personalities or Followers). The biggest thing that I point to is the location of periods. "Gain 2 Honor for each card destroyed." is its own statement on the card with nothing linking it to the previous statement.
If it had been written,
"Target a number of Personalities or Followers opposing him up to his Personal Honor. Destroy each opposing target with 0 Force, gain 2 Honor for each card destroyed." OR "Target a number of Personalities or Followers opposing him up to his Personal Honor. Destroy each opposing target with 0 Force gaining 2 Honor for each card destroyed this way.
I could understand the confusion, but this seems very cut and dry to me. With the Championship weekend fast approaching I beg you rules kami to take a second look at this.
Sorry, but it's not clear to me what the actual point of contention is.
If the point is to argue that A Noble end should generate an honor gain for (say) items that are secondarily destroyed because the Personality is, no. The Glossary example exactly parallels the text of A Noble End.
Additional: I think I see the issue. A Noble End destroys a Personality and Followers. You get honor for those, because they were directly destroyed by the card's effect. The original question asked about "attachments" generally (which would include Items, Spells). You do not get honor for destroying non-Follower attachments, because they are not destroyed directly.
A player, 6 November 2008
http://www.alderac.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=933257#p933257
The point of contention, I think, is that A Noble End is not looking for direct destruction of cards. It just says that you gain honour for each card that is destroyed, not each card destroyed from it's effect.
Dan Jacobson (rules official), 6 November 2008
http://www.alderac.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=933257#p933257
The point of contention, I think, is that A Noble End is not looking for direct destruction of cards. It just says that you gain honour for each card that is destroyed, not each card destroyed from it's effect.
Please see this for an explanation of why destroying a personality with attachments with A Noble End does not gain you 2 honor for each attachment destroyed in this manner, unless you destroy the attachments as well with a Noble End's effect (i.e. they were 0F followers and you targeted them as well).