Bayushi Saya and Doomed Intentions

L5R CCG Rules board, 12 September 2007

A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.

A player, 12 September 2007

Relevant Cards:

Bayushi Saya Scorpion Clan • Samurai • Courtier Political Open: Target a Personality. After the next time this turn his controller assigns him or an action resolves that he performed, his controller loses Honor equal to his Personal Honor, then he is dishonored.

Doomed Intentions Reaction: After another player's action resolves that dishonored any of his own Personalities: Destroy one of those target Personalities. Battle: If there are enemy units at the current battlefield: Move one of your target units there. If it moved, straighten it. If you are the Defender, take an additional Battle action printed on a card in the unit.

The situation:

I target one of his personalities with my Bayushi Saya. My opponent uses an ability on the targeted personality, thus dishonoring him. I react with Doomed Intentions, killing his personality. Legal?

Basically, is it Saya's ability that is dishonoring the targeted personality, or is it the personalities own ability that is dishonoring the target personality because Saya "adds" a dishonoring effect to the action?

Martin Lund (rules official), 12 September 2007

I target one of his personalities with my Bayushi Saya. My opponent uses an ability on the targeted personality, thus dishonoring him. I react with Doomed Intentions, killing his personality. Legal?

No. Nowhere in the effects of the ability he used does it say to Dishonor the Personality. Saya doesn't modify any other card's abilities. The effect is that of her own Action and will not successfully provide a trigger for Doomed Intentions. When Saya's action resolves, it hasn't dishonored anything yet - only set in motion an effect that could later dishonor someone. When someone else's action resolves that triggers Saya's lingering effect, it still isn't that other action's effect that does the Dishonoring.