A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.
If I announce Cavalry Escort, and produce an insufficient amount of gold, can I additionally produce gold during the action's recruit effect? If no, how can I use a Colonial Dojo to pay for the action?
I see cavalry escort as being different from a lot of actions with variable gold cost, as it doesn't reference the amount paid in any way (as Deliberations does, for example), and it creates an effect that normally allows you to produce gold.
Thanks
If I announce Cavalry Escort, and produce an insufficient amount of gold, can I additionally produce gold during the action's recruit effect? If no, how can I use a Colonial Dojo to pay for the action?
I see cavalry escort as being different from a lot of actions with variable gold cost, as it doesn't reference the amount paid in any way (as Deliberations does, for example), and it creates an effect that normally allows you to produce gold.
Thanks
I'm unsure of exactly where you're going with this question, but you produce the gold during Cavalry Escort's Recruit effect. This would also be when you would use Colonial Dojo.
As a follow up to this.
Is this correct, is there an opportunity to produce gold/use relevant traits during the Cavalry Escort's Recruit effect? What is the trigger? Page 37 of the comprehensive rules seems to suggest that Recruit as effects text has no cost step (you refer to the costs paid during the original action). If this is correct does that mean no-one ever needs to pay any gold during the Cavalry Escort's cost step? This is relevant because it seems like anyone could choose to pay 0G, wait to see if there are any interrupts that might stop the ability's effects from resolving (such as The Sun Returns) and then pay all the gold required during whatever the trigger is for the ruling above.
Sometimes, as with Equip (p. 36), “Recruit” is used as an effect in card text. This means that the effects of the Recruit action are activated, and the card’s Gold Cost is checked against the amount paid for the original action. If the original action did not give the opportunity to pay Gold, then before the card enters play, its Gold Cost must be paid or the entering play fails. The original action may modify any of the rules of the Recruit procedure; for example, it may ask you to Recuit a card “from the discard pile.”
I have bolded the relevant text for emphasis. When the card effect goes to Recruit the Personality, there is not another window to produce Gold, as Calvary Escort did previously indeed give you an opportunity to pay gold for it's Recruit effect in it's *GC icon as part of it's Battle ability.
In response to this.
That was my point, that there shouldn't be an opportunity to produce gold after the initial cost step. Daidoji Ryushi's response (and my understanding of the rules) conflicts with Palmer's response to the original question. He said "you produce the gold during Cavalry Escort's Recruit effect", which is very different to producing gold etc during the cost step of the Cavalry Escort's ability. I was trying to show that Palmer's response creates a second opportunity to pay for the recruit where none should exist. I tried to give an example of how this could create an overly-powerful and unintended loophole.
In response to this.
That was my point, that there shouldn't be an opportunity to produce gold after the initial cost step. Daidoji Ryushi's response (and my understanding of the rules) conflicts with Palmer's response to the original question. He said "you produce the gold during Cavalry Escort's Recruit effect", which is very different to producing gold etc during the cost step of the Cavalry Escort's ability. I was trying to show that Palmer's response creates a second opportunity to pay for the recruit where none should exist. I tried to give an example of how this could create an overly-powerful and unintended loophole.
Jon's response earlier is indeed misleading. You must pay the cost, and produce the gold, during the "Pay Costs" step of the action, not during the "Action's Resolution" step.
However, if you use Colonial Dojo to reduce to zero the cost of the Personality being Recruited, this is done during the "Action's Resolution" step.
In regards to this: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=108887
Since one would use Colonial Dojo well after the costs for Cavalry Escort must be paid, does that mean one cannot use Colonial Dojo to pay for the personality being recruited with Cavalry Escort?
~Andrew
In regards to this: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=108887
Since one would use Colonial Dojo well after the costs for Cavalry Escort must be paid, does that mean one cannot use Colonial Dojo to pay for the personality being recruited with Cavalry Escort?
~Andrew
Correction, Colonial Dojo (like School of Wizardry) has a trigger which states when it must be bowed, "When paying for a ...". Thus, these Holdings are bowed during the Pay Costs step of a Recruit action, including Cavalry Escort's Recruit action.
If you bow a Colonial Dojo while paying for a Recruit action, you must then choose a non-Unique Samurai; if you bow a School of Wizardry, you must then choose a Human Shugenja.