A topic from AEG's L5R CCG Rules forum, copied for Oracle of the Void from a copy of the forum saved in October 2015, so pages it didn't save are missing. Players' names are left out; the rules officials are named. Rulings are as they stood on these dates; later rulings, the rulebooks and the Rules Archive may differ.
A player, 5 February 2014
kfde wrote:I announce Turquoise Court. You have to choose to use Merchant Patronage a) before you know if I bow an artisan or not, b) before I decide whether the effect creates a gain or loss. Worst case scenario, I announce TC, you - racing me for honor - announce Merchant Patronage and bow a courtier to increase the "gain" by 1, and I get to decide that since it's going to you, I make it a loss instead
Nope, that 'bow to...' Part is a delayed effect, you don't bow your courtier before all things were chosen.
Am I right?
A player, 5 February 2014
What is your basis for saying it is a delayed effect? I'm afraid it is not, since there isn't a trigger marking it as such...
A player, 5 February 2014
continued from here: http://www.alderac.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=106798
If the active player played his own Merchant Patronage (so there are 2 Merchant Patronages on the one action) could he: 1) Increase the honor loss by one (if his opponent used his Merchant Patronage to target himself)? 2) Bow his Courtier (being the only personality on the active players side) from Merchant Patronage and thus not fulfilling the Political Limited, w: Bow your target unbowed Personality. You, or any player if the Personality is an Artisan, gain or lose 1 Honor. portion of the The Turquoise Court and thus cause the action to fail?
A player, 5 February 2014
Merchant Patronage's text: Political Interrupt: If the action is on another player's Holding, you choose who gains or loses any Honor from it. If you control a Courtier, you may bow him to increase the gain or loss by 1. (Emphasis mine)
You can't Interrupt your own Turquoise Court with a Merchant Patronage, only the other players can. There's no way a "Rhetoric War" could happen here.
A player, 6 February 2014
continued from: http://www.alderac.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=106798
Merchant Patronage's text: Political Interrupt: If the action is on another player's Holding, you choose who gains or loses any Honor from it. If you control a Courtier, you may bow him to increase the gain or loss by 1. (Emphasis mine)
You can't Interrupt your own Turquoise Court with a Merchant Patronage, only the other players can. There's no way a "Rhetoric War" could happen here.
I apologize for not understanding this but: 1) Is the bolded text some sort of required targeting? 2) If that is true then why is there an If at the beginning (from my interpretation it would lead me to believe that there is a choice/option)? 3) What does the If refer to as an alternate option if the first question is false? 4) Does the second effect not go off (since it is separated by a period and looks like an additional effect)?
A player, 6 February 2014
1) No, it is a restriction on taking the action. If the condition is false, the action can't be taken. See pg 4 of the "Ivory Rules Changes" pdf 2) See 1) 3) There's no alternate option. Either the condition is true and the action can be taken, or it's false and you can't take the action 4) This is an exception to the general rule of effects being independent. This isn't new, it was announced here long ago, specifically for this card.